Resource wasters....

[Fendell Orcbane]

So I just took out Ungoliant. And while I had the fight under control the whole time I still wastes 3 healing and 2*healing* potions. Not to mention that it took most of my branded arrows to kill it. He was running towards me down a long corrodor which was perfect. I just shot arrows at him the 90% of the time and used my rods for frost ball to soften him up while I picked arrows up.

While I can see how he would be a big YASD cause I feel that he is just a resource waster as a a lot of the uniques. Most of the really great gear has been picked up off the floor. And maybe a few of them have been in vaults.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I feel like the uniques need to be dropping better stuff. It doesn't always have to be better gear either, stat potions or healing potions work well too.

Also are their mushrooms of restoring in 3.1.2? I had a bunch of them in 3.0.9 but haven't found any yet.

[miyazaki]

So I just took out Ungoliant. And while I had the fight under control the whole time I still wastes 3 healing and 2*healing* potions. Not to mention that it took most of my branded arrows to kill it. He was running towards me down a long corrodor which was perfect. I just shot arrows at him the 90% of the time and used my rods for frost ball to soften him up while I picked arrows up.

While I can see how he would be a big YASD cause I feel that he is just a resource waster as a a lot of the uniques. Most of the really great gear has been picked up off the floor. And maybe a few of them have been in vaults.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I feel like the uniques need to be dropping better stuff. It doesn't always have to be better gear either, stat potions or healing potions work well too.

Also are their mushrooms of restoring in 3.1.2? I had a bunch of them in 3.0.9 but haven't found any yet.

Yup. Mushrooms of vigor. Too rare...

I don't think you will have too many people disagreeing with you about the drops. A lot of people use the !CCW/?phase combo, or staves of healing for these kinds of fights.

(p.s. Ungoliant is female...)

[Atarlost]

Well, first off Ungoliant is a she. Male spiders are dinky little things compared to females, something Tolkien was fully aware of.

[Zikke]

I agree that the worst part of end-game play is just farming for consumables while you use consumables finishing off uniques. It's rather frustrating and boring.

In 3.1.2, mushrooms of Vigor will restore all stats. I don't think they restore xp.

[Fendell Orcbane]

I agree that the worst part of end-game play is just farming for consumables while you use consumables finishing off uniques. It's rather frustrating and boring.

In 3.1.2, mushrooms of Vigor will restore all stats. I don't think they restore xp.

See, this is what I'm pretty much getting at: )

[Fendell Orcbane]

Yup. Mushrooms of vigor. Too rare...

I don't think you will have too many people disagreeing with you about the drops. A lot of people use the !CCW/?phase combo, or staves of healing for these kinds of fights.

(p.s. Ungoliant is female...)

The problem that I ran into with CCW is that you become gorged and lose speed. Which is really bad at 4900'. But yeah I was phasing away a lot. Honestly I didn't use Phase much in my last almost successful game and I had to use a TON of healing potions. Now? Not so much. Ungoliant has a ton of HPs though so you are gonna get hit with something nasty sooner or later. Better to use the healing than hope you can take the punishment I say.

[Derakon]

To my knowledge, mushrooms of Restoring never restored XP either. Thing is, you used to be able to stockpile enough mushrooms of Restoring that they'd be worth carrying with you, but in an average 3.12 game you'll find 0-2 mushrooms of Vigor. They're simply too rare to be worth worrying about.

The standard way to restore hitpoints in 3.12 is to phase away and chug a few potions of CCW. It takes longer than using Healing or *Healing* potions, but !CCW are easily replenished at the temple, assuming you're willing to deal with buying it out repeatedly (hint: start buying all their CCW every time you return to town, and never sell gear to them -- it slows down their turnover). If you're getting gorged...don't fight right after casting Satisfy Hunger? You shouldn't go swimming after eating, either...

Incidentally, nothing says you have to kill every unique. It just makes fighting Morgoth a bit less "interesting". There's a few you'd really like to get rid of (c.f. Tarrasque, Qlzqqlzuup), but a properly-equipped player can generally survive with the phase/teleport-away/Destruction combination.

[Ycombinator]

I wholeheartedly agree that consumable drops should be increased. OTOH I don't think that uniques should drop consumables and that uniques should always drop something good. I think it's fair that some uniques are resource wasters precisely because you can also get some great item from the floor or novice warrior.
Ungoliant can be a tough one, but if every fight with high level uniques goes like this, you're doing it wrong. Or simply too early.

[nullfame]

Ungoliant would not be on my list of "must kills" but I don't remember having a hard time with her. I would only seek out enemies that would make the final fights more difficult: legitimate threats (e.g., Tarrasque) and those with dangerous escorts (unique demons and liches). I don't worry about summoners since special opponents means I'm probably going to destruct anyway. If you want to off all the high-level uniques so all he can summon is cream puffs I would only kill those native to 80+.

I go out of my way to kill unique elementals in depth if I can because I hate finding them in a vault crushing everything.

[Derakon]

Ungoliant's main claim to fame is her massive HP total: 13000 (compare Sauron at 10500 and Morgoth at 20000). Her average melee damage isn't that bad: if all attacks land it's 28 + 28 + 44 + 20 = 120 before AC damage reduction (compare Sauruon at 234 or Morgoth at 350 or a greater titan at 312). She also can self-heal, cast darkness storms, and breathe poison and darkness; she has six "useless" spells (blind, slow, confuse, scare, cause darkness, summon kin) which means that her more dangerous spells come out ~40% of the time, or one in every 7.5 equal-speed turns. Given how long the fight will last, odds are excellent she'll hit you with some punishing darkness attacks.

If you don't feel like fighting her, she's not an especially huge threat. If you do plan to kill her, though, it'll be a slog. I recommend packing some electric or fiery missile weapons.

[Zikke]

I enjoy saving her so that when Morgoth summons her, you can TO her away and fill the room with her Cave Spiders.

[Fendell Orcbane]

I wholeheartedly agree that consumable drops should be increased. OTOH I don't think that uniques should drop consumables and that uniques should always drop something good. I think it's fair that some uniques are resource wasters precisely because you can also get some great item from the floor or novice warrior.
Ungoliant can be a tough one, but if every fight with high level uniques goes like this, you're doing it wrong. Or simply too early.

Darkness storm (430) that alone makes her a threat. At the time I had 622 hps and the first time she did it I was down to 398 hps. So I'd be forced to heal everytime this happened.

I tend to be paranoid, because what if I don't notice another unique nearby that hits me out of nowhere? That would end my game real quick.

[Fendell Orcbane]

Ungoliant's main claim to fame is her massive HP total: 13000 (compare Sauron at 10500 and Morgoth at 20000). Her average melee damage isn't that bad: if all attacks land it's 28 + 28 + 44 + 20 = 120 before AC damage reduction (compare Sauruon at 234 or Morgoth at 350 or a greater titan at 312). She also can self-heal, cast darkness storms, and breathe poison and darkness; she has six "useless" spells (blind, slow, confuse, scare, cause darkness, summon kin) which means that her more dangerous spells come out ~40% of the time, or one in every 7.5 equal-speed turns. Given how long the fight will last, odds are excellent she'll hit you with some punishing darkness attacks.

If you don't feel like fighting her, she's not an especially huge threat. If you do plan to kill her, though, it'll be a slog. I recommend packing some electric or fiery missile weapons.

This is the reason that I took her out...I'd hate to run into her when I'm dealing with Morgoth.

[Derakon]

Why were you fighting a major unique enemy like Ungoliant with less than, oh, 800HP? Get your CON up, man! And your level!

[Fendell Orcbane]

Why were you fighting a major unique enemy like Ungoliant with less than, oh, 800HP? Get your CON up, man! And your level!

I've been trying to find potions of CON for a long time. I have +8 CON from equipment. And I didn't consider Ungoliant a major threat...Funny enough that you tell me this because it seems like everyone here could have done a better job with less equipment than I have...BTW my speed is +34 with haste self. Which is a big help.